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Spinning My Tires is one man's view of the world of cars. Random thoughts, ideas and comments pop up here, all of them related to owning, driving and restoring cars. I've been doing this car thing as long as I can remember, and have enjoyed a great many car-related experiences, some of which I hope to share with you here. And I always have an opinion one way or another. Enjoy. E-mails are welcomed--if you have thoughts of your own to share, please send them. Additional Spinning My Tires editorials can be found on the Archives page. 9/4/03 More Letters to the Editor
You guys sure are prolific! I’ve gotten a lot of E-mails lately from other people who are getting into old cars for the first time, or who are deciding not to modify their current projects and instead restore them to original condition. I’m honored that I’ve inspired you, and I’m very pleased to see more people starting to get interested in old iron for its own sake. I won’t take all the credit, but at least the people E-mailing me say that I’ve been an inspiration, and for that, I have no words. I’m flattered, but more importantly, I’m excited because it might mean that restoring old cars is catching on with younger folks. That’s definitely a good thing. One of the main themes of most of these letters is how to find a collector car, and once you find one, how do you know if it is restorable? Other people send me photos or a link to an ad and ask what I think the car is worth and should they buy it. Still others say they already have a project car, and what techniques would I recommend in a given situation (usually rust repair). So I thought I’d share some letters with you (I’m keeping them anonymous, however, just in case), as well as my answers to them. Perhaps these will answer some of your questions, too. Keep those
E-mails
coming! I try to answer them all. I’m looking at buying a 1939 Buick Special 4-door sedan from a friend of my neighbor. I can get it for a really good price but I don’t know if it is a good car. Are 39 Buicks good cars and do you think this one is worth restoring? It is mostly original except for the paint, which is in bad shape anyway with a lot of rust on the roof and hood. It’s been sitting outside for about 15 years and hasn’t been driven since then. My neighbor says the engine still turns, but it doesn’t run and needs a rebuild. It is also missing the glass in the windshield and side windows. Any advice would be great. It sounds like you’re looking at a car that needs 100% restoration. You don’t say how much he is asking, but I don’t think I would pay more than $500 for it, possibly less. The main thing is that Buick Special 4-door sedans of any year are probably the most common of all Buicks, so they aren’t very valuable in any condition, and nice restorable ones are easy to find and inexpensive. If you’re looking for a car to restore as an investment, this definitely isn’t the one. However, if you are looking for a first project, this could be a good one to practice on. If you are just starting out as a restorer, Buicks are good choices because parts and information are plentiful, and they were well constructed when new, so they rarely have irreparable damage to important parts, and if you don’t do a professional job, so what? It’s just a Special sedan, no great loss and you would learn a lot from it. If the engine turns, then it is probably rebuildable, which just about any 65-year-old engine would require, especially one sitting for fifteen years. Parts for the 248-cubic-inch straight-8 are easy to find, though not particularly cheap (about $1100 for a rebuild kit). My biggest concern with a car like you have described is rust. Significant rust makes me walk away from any potential project car, and you should be prepared to do the same. Few things are as expensive, difficult to repair and heartbreaking as rust. Surface rust is not a problem, nor is rust on the frame or other “big metal” pieces. Some rust holes in the body and fenders are not a problem, though they do take some advanced metalworking to repair. The biggest potential problem with this particular car would be the missing glass—how long has it been missing and where has the car been stored? If it’s been outside for fifteen years without glass, I’m betting that the floors, dashboard, rocker panels and seat frames are all long gone. This kind of stuff is extremely difficult to repair properly. The things I evaluate when looking at potential projects are the following, in order of importance:
If the car is solid (and I mean really solid), then take a chance and treat it as a learning experience. The ‘39s are great looking cars and drive as well as any late-30s Buicks. But if it is rough, or you have doubts about your ability to fix something on it, then walk away. There are always other cars out there. It always pays to spend more up front for better base stock than to bring a hulk back from the dead. Hope this helps and good luck with your project! How in the world did you find that car? I’ve been looking for a similar car for months now (a Pontiac version of the fastback coupe) with no luck. I check all the local ads and read Hemmings, but there are never any cars like I want. Do you know anyone who has a car like I’m looking for or who could give me some leads? I’m stumped. First, join the Pontiac club if you haven’t already. Club members are a great resource if you’re looking for something specific. The chain of “I know a guy who knows a guy who has one” can be very long and effective in club circles. Most clubs also put out monthly publications with for sale ads in them that are exclusive to that make of car, so your chances might go up looking in one of those. You’re already reading Hemmings, and that’s my #1 recommendation. Most people who have old cars know it is the place to buy or sell an old car. Most other publications are afterthoughts, much as I hate to say it. In my case, my car never even showed up in Hemmings or any other magazine—it was an Internet find and I bought it the day after it hit the 'Net. It is very important to use all the tools available, and the Internet is one of the best because it offers so many options for free! Most sites that list cars for sale make their money from the sellers, so you can reference their ads for free. Look for places that specialize in old cars, or have an old cars listing—you don’t want to sort through a thousand ads for 1979 Pontiacs looking for a ’41, right? Here are the sites I checked regularly looking for my Century (I still look at them to keep track of what’s out there):
Your club should also have a web site with a message forum. Go there and post a message about what you are looking for. In fact, go anywhere there is old car discussion and tell them what you want and see what happens. It’s like fishing—you have to be in the right spot with the right bait to catch a fish. The more often you go out on the water, the better your chances of catching a fish and the better you’ll get at it. Good luck finding your dream car! I’m working on a ’46 Plymouth convertible that has a lot of rust in the trunk area. The floor is OK and I can fix what’s there, but the body right below where the fenders bolt on is really bad. I’ve been trying to find patch panels for a long time but nobody seems to have any. Do you have any recommendations for how to fix this? I was thinking I would use some “kitty hair” to fill the holes and then sand it smooth and cover it with POR15. What do you think? Thanks for your help and great website! I think it is unlikely that you will find patch panels for a car of this vintage. They just weren’t necessary at the time these cars were being repaired. You’ll have to fix what you have, I’m afraid. How to do that? Well, first let me tell you that I’m not an expert on bodywork by any stretch. I’ve read a lot of books and worked on a lot of cars, but there was always somebody supervising me who was the expert. So the advice I’m going to give you is collected from a variety of sources. But the one thing all sources can agree upon is that rusty metal must be cut out and clean metal welded in if you want good results (which it sounds like you want). Using “kitty hair” and bondo to fill holes is beyond hack work, and has no place on a car you intend to keep for any length of time (I’d also argue that you shouldn’t do it on a car you plan to sell because of how angry it’ll make the new owner when it falls out, but I digress). The first thing you need to do is determine the extent of the damage. You can’t do this until the body is completely stripped. And by stripped, I mean not only disassembled, but either chemically or mechanically cleaned of all paint, undercoatings and rust. Rust is like an iceberg—there’s always a lot that you don’t see. When you have the car stripped, it will reveal much more extensive rust damage than you thought you had. Sorry to break that to you, but there is light at the end of the tunnel. Once you’ve identified the extent of the rust damage, you can get to work fixing it. The only correct way to permanently remove rust is to cut it out, weld in new metal and seal it with a moisture-resistant coating. Anything less is just a waste of your time and money because it will come back. So cut out the rust. I prefer to cut it out in easy-to-duplicate shapes like squares, rectangles and triangles. Straight lines are easier to cut and weld than curved ones. If you have to cut it on a curve because of a body line or brace, then do it, but if you can, keep the patches straight. It will make your life easier. Next, use metal of the same gauge as your car’s body and cut it into shapes that match the holes you’ve cut in the body. Some people use lap welds and therefore make their patch panels big enough to cover the hole, then flange the edges to make it fit flush, but again, I think this is hack work. Lap welds can be a starting place for new rust to form, and they are more difficult to hide from anyone who goes looking for them. What I prefer is a butt weld, which means that the gap between the body and the patch is where you weld the two together to form one continuous piece of metal. If you are careful, you can grind down the welds, use a little filler, and it will look like it was never damaged. Now, I’m assuming you can weld sheetmetal. If you can’t, then either (1) learn, or (2) farm the entire job out to someone who knows what they are doing. You can’t make this repair without welding. There are no substitutes. Make this decision now, before you start cutting the car. Once you’ve got the panel in place, have the welds ground down and smoothed, you need to topcoat the repair. In most cases, this can just be the same primers and paints you use on the rest of the car. If it is a place that experiences a lot of moisture and will be hidden, such as the inside of your trunk, then consider using a coating like Zero-Rust (what I use) or POR-15 or Eastwood’s Rust Encapsulator. These coatings are more durable than body paint and will (in most cases) permanently seal the repair. But only use them where the repair will be out of sight: they don’t take well to being top-coated without a lot of extra steps. I also like Picklex-20, a metal conditioner you put on bare metal to eliminate micro-rust and preserve bare metal until you can paint it. You can paint over the Picklex with any paint you want. Don’t just use primer, however, to finish your repair. Most primers (not epoxy primers, however) are porous and will absorb water. That’s right, most primers are not waterproof. You see those guys driving down the road in their beaters with primer on the rusty fenders, thinking that they’ve stopped the progression of the rust, but in reality, they’ve probably accelerated it because moisture gets trapped in the primer right next to the metal! So don’t just prime it and leave it at that, even if you think that area will never get wet again. Moisture in the air is enough to start rust. So if you do use primer over the repair, make sure it gets a coat of actual paint to protect it. One last thing: go to www.autobodystore.com and learn everything you can. The guys there really know their stuff! Hope this helps and good luck with the repairs! See you next month. E-mail me at toolman8@sbcglobal.net This page accessed Thanks, Fidget! |